Meeting documents

Area Forum (Heswall and Pensby & Thingwall)
Tuesday, 23rd October 2007

Present

Chair

PSC Johnson

Ward Councillors

AC Hodson, IJ Mackenzie, Sarah Quinn, SL Rowlands

Community and Older Peoples' Parliament Representative

A Garrett (Heswall Community Representative and Older Peoples' Parliament Representative

Lead Officer

Chris Batman (Head of Branch, Planning and Resources, Children and Young People's Department)

Area Service Co-ordinator

Tracey Smith

Street Scene Manager

Mark Traynor

Merseyside Police

Sergeant Chris Hitchell

Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service

Paul Gibson

Apologies

S Cameron (Older Peoples Parliament), Councillor MG Redfern

Index to Minutes

Minute 1 - Welcome, introductions and apologies

Minute Text :

The Chairman welcomed all those present, and said it was good to see so many people. The panel introduced themselves, and the meeting was opened.

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Minute 2 - Area co-ordinators Report - Minutes of last meeting and matters arising

Minute Text :

Tracey asked whether all had received the Minutes of the last meeting, and they were agreed as a correct report. Tracey stated that there were no matters arising which were not dealt with in her Report.
Section 2 Local Updates. Health in the Community – Agencies on Wirral are to join forces to try and reduce the use of alcohol by young people, and the hope is that this will reduce anti-social behaviour. Older Peoples’ Parliament
New legislation is to come into force in July 2008 with regard to free travel for the elderly.
Page 28 Primary Care Trust will give £5,000. to support the Local Authority Community Initiative Fund to promote health improving activities in this Forum area. The Voluntary and Community sector will be invited to submit applications, but will have to meet funding limits and priorities. All applications must address the following health themes.
a) Wirral taste for health – better access to healthy, affordable foods and helping people develop shopping and cookery skills.
b) Wirral Active – encouraging people to participate in enjoyable and health enhancing activities.
c) Smoke free Wirral, support for people to stop smoking and protection for children from second hand smoke.
d) Damage limitation – providing activities for young people to reduce harm related to alcohol misuse.
There is a closing date for applications of 14th November 2007.

Section Four – Local Transport Update. It is hoped that there will be a further report at the next Forum.

Section Five – Area Forum Funding Progress Report. A complete list of funds which have been allocated is shown. There is, however, some money still available (£8,657.71p.) applications for the fund must be received by November 2nd

Section Six – Local Area Forum Plan Update. Progress has been made on this, and the Director of Technical Services reported to Cabinet on 20th June with proposals in respect of road safety and walking and cycling in Wirral, and how these could be improved. Allocations were agreed for works with regard to walking and cycling, and further details will be included in the Area Forum Plan for 07/08.

Section Seven – Streetscene Update. The seven residents’ parking zones completed their consultation, but the final decision was that they were not wanted. The Council will now write to all those involved. There are to be slight changes to what may be put into the grey bins, and residents will be notified shortly. Future carriageway and footway works were itemised in this Section.

Section Eight – Equalities and Diversity. To find out more visit the Council’s website or contact Ged Smyth by email – gerardsmyth@wirral.gov.uk

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Minute 3 - Public question time

Minute Text :

A question was raised about the Wirral University Hospital or PCT. What does this mean as regards the Hospital? Len Corman replied that he would find out and feed the information back to Tracey Smith.
A question was put, as a user of the Health Service, have you tried to re-arrange an appointment which you are unable to keep? It would seem that you are put to the back of the queue. This will be logged in the Minutes, and there will be a response at the next meeting.
Frank Bell is particularly perturbed about the disregard of notices by the lorries which come down Barnston Road. It is very difficult to make a note of the names, and numbers, but the increase recently has been to five or six per day. He wondered whether the Police have ever caught anyone, and what is proposed to stop this? Sergeant Hitchell replied that they did speak to the Aldi Depot, and they do patrol these areas constantly. Lorries have been stopped and given advice about using different routes. He stated that they will look at this again, and Mr. Bell asked whether anyone had ever been fined. Sgt. Hitchell was asked to bring details to the next Forum of anyone
who had been stopped and/or fined. Mr. Garrett also reported that he thinks there is an increase of lorries along Brimstage Road and through Brimstage Village. If they can fit under the railway bridge, they will continue to go that way, and Sgt. Hitchell admitted that this is a problem in Brimstage Road. Cllr. Quinn has received many letters about the junction in Gills Lane, and asked whether the ‘rumble’ strips might be helpful. David Collinson raised the same problem at the junction of Dee View Road/Dawstone Road. It was agreed that these are difficult, but the accident rates are not too high and do not warrant any work. A request was made for a light to be put in the dark passage near the Shell Garage where it goes through to Dunster Grove, and Mark Traynor agreed and will look into providing a street light there.
Graham Ashdown pointed out that at the bottom of Gills Lane the lines are always worn away, and if you come round with a trailer on, it is very dangerous. It might be an idea for a rumble strip, or flashing lights to warn drivers to take care.
Attention was drawn again to Broad Lane, where most of the residents are fairly elderly (over 80). It was pointed out that Broad Lane changes from a highway to a bridle path, and they have been trying for six or seven years to get things done – there is a list of names and addresses available. Some people are unable to drive and some cannot walk, and there is 100 metre strip which needs tarmaccing urgently. He has written to the Council, but they responded that it is a bridle way, but something must be done. Residents only have one bin, and the nearest bus stop is three quarters of a mile away. If there is still some money left, SOMETHING MUST BE DONE.
Cllr. Hodson replied that he had been speaking to Sandy Cameron and David Green, the Director, has been down to have a look, and he will report back as soon as he has a reply. The Regency Lodge in Broad Lane is there, but the hedges are overgrown and need to be cut. David Collinson added that there is one carer who travels down, has to park her car, put on her Wellingtons and walk the rest of the way!

Val Curtis has received the dog fouling posters, and is very grateful, but would like to know how dog owners will be identified if they do not abide by the rules. Mark Traynor will get in touch with Tracey Smith.

Mr. Garrett reported that Dee View Road has potholes right down to Delavor Road. Also, the Banks Road name place is still missing at the junction of Broad Lane. The paving slabs outside Woolworths are really loose, and he has written to Phil Miner. Mark Traynor replied that this is not Council property, and the land is owned by the shops, and an approach should be made to them.

Mr. Kinlan asked about the Tesco Car Wash request, and Cllr. Hodson replied that it was a ‘blanket’ request all over the country, and he has been told by someone in Planning that this will not happen. Tesco are, however, looking to have later deliveries, up to 11 p.m., and this is being looked at again. Tesco have put forward a proposal to build a large wall at the back. Mr. Kinlan also asked when will Street Scene check the trees in Greenbank Drive.

Mark Traynor said they are all checked annually, but Mr. Kinlan said he has not seen anyone in Greenbank Road.
What is the hospital policy on postponing hospital appointments, and what are the criteria? 330,000 outpatients a year, and about 10,000 of these do not attend. They are given two further appointments and if they miss them, they will be passed back to the doctor. Cllr. Rowlands asked if when someone who had to cancel because of an accident, would they go to the back of the queue?
All Consultants have a list, and they are booked up for about ten weeks, so there would not be a vacant slot. They wish to fill all appointments, and try not to cancel appointments, which causes patients upset, but it is impossible to ring someone up on the same day that more than one patient does not arrive for his or her appointment.
Graham Dingwall asked what was the plan now that The Warrens did not receive Planning Permission for the Medical Centre. Kathy Doran from the PCT replied that they have not yet decided what to do as there is no other site. The current Surgery in use is a disgrace, and the PCT is considering appealing. Graham Dingwall was also concerned that The Warrens would rapidly become derelict, and vandals would have a field day there. He now works at Dale Farm and would like to know what is happening.
John Thompson asked could the Council give some political guidance to the Planners, particularly with the disgraceful problem of the three buildings. It was suggested that they are talked about, but where are they? The Council have guide lines for the Green Belt.
Chris Batman stressed the independent role of the Planning Committee. Proposals from Council Departments are often returned or amended. There does have to be a separation between the Planning Officers and the Planning Committee. Mr. Thompson replied he did not mention Planning Officers.

Mr. Garrett asked if there is any sense in looking at the three schools which are to be closed. They will close from 31st August 2008.
Chris Batman said that currently proposals for amalgamation of Pensby Infants and Pensby Juniors are still out for consultation, so at present there are no school sites available. Frank Kinlan said that for people to say there has been no land available for 50 years is wrong. It is a fact that at the Foxes there was one house and they put several houses on it. Rose Brae Nurseries is another example where many dwellings have been erected. The Boys Camp was empty for eleven years, which would have been suitable, and now they have a Clinic for 29 patients. The PCT have not been looking for 50 years, employing a whole range of advisers to fit the size of surgery needed for the people of Heswall and Pensby. There is no other option at the moment, so say why the application was put in and the current surgeries cannot cope. Kathy Doran replied that the Thingwall surgery is a disgrace – if you are in a wheel chair you cannot get in. They are looking to put porta-cabins on the three sites.
John Thompson suggested that this issue was more important than the overhanging trees.

Val Curtis, Friends of Arrowe Park, said that the committee made recommendations, and gave the reasons why The Warrens was not suitable. The evidence suggests that we are looking at a mini-hospital rather than a Health Centre. The Pensby Hotel was offered two years ago and the land at the British Legion. There were very few letters of community support, and some people signed two objections. We need our Park and Arrowe Park Hospital is encroaching all the time, and there are alternatives.
Kathy Doran stated that this is a single practice, three doctors working together for their patients, and it was not for a mini-hospital. The doctors need to be in a single building to serve the people of Wirral, and that is what the PCT will continue to provide.
Cllr. Rowlands said he has been to many meetings where the PCT has listened to the arguments of members of that committee who voted to refuse. Everyone listened, and all parties supported the voting. He keeps hearing that it will help the people of this area, but it is not just Heswall, it is Gayton, Pensby and Thingwall. Have you given thought to the distance people would have to travel? Being a practical man, the Centre should be put in the middle.
Kathy Doran said that in West Wirral there is the Heswall Medical Centre, and they are trying to provide two better facilities at either end of the area. This would enable patients to have more choice, and at the end of the day people will have to decide whether they wish to stay with the Doctor they know, or they wish to move forward. There will be continued services in Heswall.
Cllr. Rowlands reported that he was annoyed that in one waiting room in Heswall the names of two Councillors who voted against it have been put up, and this is upsetting. He was also sorry to hear that one doctor’s house had been grafittied.
Val Curtis understood that there is a Steering Group, and wished to know who is on it and when does it meet.
Ken Gethin reported that his son was involved in an accident on 3rd August, and a cyclist. This was reported, but so far no-one has been back to him, and he has had to do all the work himself, and it was the cyclist’s fault. Sergeant Hitchell will take this back and find out what has happened. Mr. Gethin said that he does not know if the cyclist is well or not.

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Minute 4 - Partner Updates - Fire & Rescue Service - Police - Community Safety - Wirral Primary Care Trust - Wirral University Teaching Hospital NHS Foundation Trust

Minute Text :

Paul Gibson, Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service. Work is continuing on the Integrated Fire and Rescue Plan, and this will be available in Birkenhead on 13th December. It was reported in the last minutes that there was concern over the anti-social behaviour and fire lighting on the Dales and Whitfield Common. The Fire Authority has received £5,000. from one of the Area Forums, and 240 youngsters at Birkenhead Fire Station have been spoken to and shown the work which the Service does, and engaged them in tasks, and this has proved very successful. The main issue at the moment is the home fire maintenance checks. They have recently carried out 1,000 fire checks, and Paul asked if anyone in the audience knew of a vulnerable person to let him know, and they would visit and fit the free fire alarms. There is also the Winter Warm Campaign, testing electric blankets. Out of 700 tested, 300 were defective, which has avoided 300 house fires or burning or death. He emphasised that untested electric blankets should not be used. Bonfire night approaches, and last year the Service was stretched with approximately 1500 nuisance fires, which cost the rate payers nearly £30,000. Part of this cost was the Probation Service using Birkenhead Fire Station going out and clearing bonfires. There is a number 0800 7315958 to call to get the nuisance open fires cleaned up before any damage is done. There are now legal dates for the sale of fireworks (15th October to the 9th November), but there are some places selling them out of boxes in the back etc. One and a half tons of fireworks were confiscated. The Service also has a Trojan vehicle available to go into the areas where there is trouble, and this will be a shock for people who are misbehaving.

Chris.Hitchell Merseyside Police. Last time Inspector Cunningham reported on the reduction of crime, and from April until now, there have been big reductions from last year, they are down by 13%, burglaries 11%, criminal 20% and vehicle crime by 50%. Much of this is done by the excellent work done by the Community Support Team and the high visibility in the area.
Three of the ASO have got football badges within schools and also on Friday nights, and this is going well. Some other activities organised – Halloween Party in Pensby on 31st October, extra resources for ‘Mischief Night’ and Bonfire Night. Priorities for the whole neighbourhood were speeding vehicles, and now for about eight weeks please be more vigilant with presents etc. in cars and also in your home.
Mr. Garrett asked that you stop and breathalyse drink drivers, how do you stop those who are taking drugs? How many cases have there been on the Wirral? How many community policemen are there travelling on buses and showing their presence?
Sgt. Hitchell answered 1) Suspicion of a driver would cause him to be pulled up, and then they have equipment for testing for drink. Dependant on the result, it is then up to the Officer to decide that it may be drugs, but there is no technical equipment in the car. The Officer would, if he thought it necessary, take the person to the Police Station where they can be tested. There are ‘hot spots’ and the Officers target them.
2) There are CSO who work out of Heswall and use the buses on a daily basis, and they also use the train service.
Frank Kinlan asked about the cars that are parked on Pensby Road, just before May Road. Sgt. Hitchell replied that it has to be an obstruction offence before they can take action, and they have to take note of the double yellow lines. Mr. Kinlan said they are crossing the yellow lines, mounting the pavement, and then backing into the road. It was pointed out that there is a block of shops beyond May Road where there is room to park on land owned by the shops, but that motorists do have to cross the pavement to do so.

Cathy Newman, Community Safety. Cathy reminded everyone of the DVLA Project that whenever Parking Wardens, CSO or Police see vehicles with items on display a letter is forwarded to tell people not to leave items on view in future. Talking CCTV funding has been received from the Government and this has enabled operators in the Council’s CCTV Control Room to prevent and challenge anti-social and criminal behaviour by broadcasting directly to members of the public and giving out key messages relating to crime and disorder. The cameras are mostly within the Birkenhead area.
Youth Respect Team launched in July consists of youth workers and play workers who wear distinctive red jackets, to try and prevent (or reduce) ASB by youngsters.
Housing Associations and registered Landlords who have signed up to the Housing Standards on 26th June 2007 also signed up to Wirral Respect. The Standard challenges unacceptable behaviour and promotes good behaviour.
Cllr. Rowlands welcomed this report and the excellent cctv cameras which can speak directly to those offending. The problem is that there are plans in Council for cuts during the day.

Kathy Doran, PCT, reported that there is a small grants programme, and they are keen for Community groups to avail themselves of it. We wish that people who have views or ideas about the future of health services would contact us, as we are trying to produce a specific piece of work trying to look at the future of health services on Wirral over the next five years. We should be glad if you would let us know where you feel the PCT should be developed.
It is not acceptable that many of those born in a regeneration area have a life span of possibly eleven years less than those born in the better area. We are living longer, however, and the aging population services need to be developed.
Alcohol misuse – this area is one of the highest in the country.
Improving services for children and young people.
General modernisation of services.
Please submit your views and let us have feedback.

Frank Kinlan asked why were forms not given to every patient coming out of hospital, and Kathy replied that they are available in hospital.

Dental problems. The PCT are currently in discussion with two dentists about setting up in Greasby. Four dentists on Wirral have gone private. There are 55 Dental practices on Wirral with 120 dentists who have open lists. Please contact the PCT if you have trouble getting on a list. Wirral has more NHS dentists than anywhere in the country.
Frank Kinlan said that because he has had a transplant, there is no dentist he can go to.

David Steele asked what were the views on the type of services which will be used in the super Medical Centres. The reply was that the plans have been in the making for eight or nine years, and that the hope is that people will be treated near their own home, with a practice able to deal with weight problems, alcohol problems etc., blood tests etc., so that people who are on Warfarin for example can be regularly monitored. There will be counsellors in the surgeries to help with monetary problems etc., and in some surgeries physiotherapy and a whole range of services, but NOT hospital services, but they will enable people to maintain their health and monitor their condition.

Paul Holt, Wirral University Teaching Hospital NHS Foundation Trust.
Information about what the hospital provides. Every patient on discharge
A satisfaction survey, and we are also trying to find out what the public think is good and what is bad, and what could be improved. Please return them. The Foundation Trust now means that they are responsible to the Trust. Bugs come into the hospital, and at this time of year winter variants cause nausea and vomiting. HANDS MUST BE WASHED.
Cllr. Rowlands asked that if, at the end of a consultation, you have the information that the public want, would you kindly return and report to the Forum.

A gentleman wished to say that he had been in Ward 30, and the staff were fantastic, but the space was very confined, the bed was almost touching the next one, with people all sitting round getting their drips.

Comment was made that in the Day Unit people were walking in and out of the hospital still smoking. A comment was made that if you are fit enough to walk to the door, you are fit enough to go home. The hospital takes it very seriously and endeavours to try and get people to give up smoking. People asked whether the security people can stop them smoking, but this would not be possible.

David Steele said that many people have a great fear of picking up more bugs going into hospital. Is it not possible to say that one of the causes is we are bringing this stuff in unnecessarily? Should patients be told that they cannot go beyond the door of the ward? The hospital cannot keep people without their agreement.

Mrs. Rafferty knows two elderly people who got MRSA in the hospital and died. She also pointed out that some of the nurses go home in their uniform.
Paul replied that those working in very serious areas do have the scrub dress. Many staff in Nursing Homes etc. go home in uniform, but the policy is that they should be covered if they are not in the hospital. With regard to smoking, the same rules apply. The staff are encouraged to give up smoking, as it is not good for them, nor for a patient to have a smoker leaning over them.

Bernd Heerwagen Older People’s Parliament.
Bernd reported, in the absence of Sandy Cameron, that the Older People’s Parliament now had 51 volunteer members, and that they are looking at ways of recruiting for the future. The main sub-committees now cover transport, health and social care, life long learning, disability issues and housing, and members will be meeting with officials in all these fields in order that the wishes of the older citizens are brought to their attention. They are also planning guides to residential and nursing homes in Wirral, and a similar guide to all older people’s housing in the Borough. We also need extra help for these projects, so anyone interested, please come forward.

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Minute 5 - Dates of Future meetings/Presentations

Minute Text :

Date of next meeting - Tuesday, 12th February 2008 - Venue to be agreed.

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Minute 6 - Any other business

Minute Text :

Mr. Garrett asked about papers for the Forum Local Travel Plan, Page 30.
Julie Barnes – if in Technical Services to take on Local Transport Plan and electrification of the Bidston Line. Would Neil Scales come and speak – it was thought this was not likely.

Val Curtis Friends of Arrowe Country Park – to talk about their work.

Query about the telecommunication masts being erected.

The Chairman replied that when O2 initially applied, the recommendation was refusal for all four. A second application was received, with slightly different sites for the masts. The Council again recommended refusal on three sites, with one approval. O2 did not receive notification of the recommendation and after the statutory fifty six days, they therefore had deemed consent, and have erected them on the initial sites.

Mr. Kinlan reported that he had taken photographs of forty one broken flags on Telegraph Road, and had also seen some cut down branches of elm trees.
Mark Traynor will investigate and report back at the next Forum.

Tracey Smith reported that a request had been received from the Youth Parliament that they should have a representative on each Forum. It was agreed that this was a good idea, and Tracey will report back, and hopes that someone will attend the next Forum.

Val Curtis thanked the Chairman for allowing the amount of public participation in the meeting.

The meeting closed at approximately 9.15p.m.

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(Minutes Published: 13 December 2007)