Meeting documents
Area Forum (Oxton and Prenton)
Wednesday, 12th October 2005
Present
Chair
FM Doyle
Councillors
Mrs F E F Anderson, A Bridson, SA Holbrook, SE Kelly
Community Representatives
Alan Dollery (Prenton Tenants & Residents Assoc.), June Foster (Wirral Fed. of Tenants & Residents Assocs.), Patrick Toosey (Oxton Society)
Lead Officer
Bob Beresford (Deputy Director of Housing & Environmental Protection)
Area Service Co-ordinator
Maxine Joynson
Birkenhead & Wallasey PCT
Katy Kidd (Exec. Board Member)
Merseyside Police
Inspector Mark Smith
Council Officers
Gary Cummings (Area Streetscene Manager), Mike Walker (Community Safety Officer)
In attendance:
Margaret Davies
Apologies
Terry Hall (Wirral Youth Service), Alan Stennard (Director of Regeneration), Cllr Mrs Patricia Williams
Index to Minutes
- Minute 1 - Welcome, introductions and apologies
- Minute 2 - Minutes of the last meeting / matters arising
- Minute 3 - Correspondence
- Minute 4 - Area co-ordinators report
- Minute 5 - Area Plans
- Minute 6 - Community initiatives fund
- Minute 7 - Primary Care Trust update
- Minute 8 - Public question time
- Minute 9 - Borough Road site update
- Minute 10 - Anti Social Behaviour update
- Minute 11 - Presentation: Working together for Wirral's Children & Young People
- Minute 12 - Dates of future meetings
- Minute 13 - Any other business
Minute 1 - Welcome, introductions and apologies
Minute Text :
Cllr Frank Doyle (Chair) welcomed everybody to the meeting of the Oxton and Prenton Area Forum. He informed the audience that for the benefit of those using a hearing aid, a loop system was in operation and a microphone was available should anyone wish to use it. He also asked the meeting to note the death of Canon Alan Poulter and expressed regrets on behalf of the Forum, and introduced the forum members.
There were approximately 22 members of the public present.
Minute 2 - Minutes of the last meeting / matters arising
Minute Text :
Cllr Doyle explained that the matters arising from the previous meeting have been included in the Area Co-Ordinator’s Report under Section 1 - Local Issues. He explained that if any members of the public were dissatisfied with the explanations provided, they would have an opportunity to address this under public question time.
Cllr Doyle explained that if answers to any points raised could not be given on the night, Maxine would follow these up, in writing, before the next meeting and would include details in her Report at the next meeting.
However, there were a couple of matters raised by Mrs Colbreck at the last meeting that Maxine Joynson (Area Co-ordinator) wished to bring up under this item.
i. Concern over the noise levels on the Durley Drive Estate and in particular with regard to Oxton Windows. She reported that a Council official was visiting her earlier that morning and hopefully this would lead to a satisfactory resolution.
ii. Concern over pavements behind the shops in Prenton Hall Road. She had been in correspondence with Alan Dollery and had explained to him that the problem lay with Wirral Partnership Homes who needed to ensure that the roads were adopted and hopefully this would happen shortly and the necessary repairs undertaken.
Minute 3 - Correspondence
Minute Text :
Maxine informed the forum that she had received correspondence on the following:
i. The financial loss that the organisers of this summer’s Merseyfest had incurred. Rob Beresford explained that the Merseyfest issue would be raised at a meeting of the Leaders of all Merseyside Councils and he will report back following the discussions with the other Merseyside Councils.
ii. Oxton Conservation Area raised by Mr Lennon, who was present at the meeting. Mr Lennon was asked if he was satisfied with the response received. Mr Lennon felt that he had not received a satisfactory reply and Cllr Doyle suggested that it be dealt with under Item 8 - Public Question Time.
iii. Future Committees and a Police incident raised by Mr Dowling, who was present at the meeting. Mr Dowling was asked if he was satisfied with the response that he had received. He was happy with the information received regarding future committees however, wished the Police incident to be addressed in more detail. Cllr Doyle suggested this be addressed under Item 10 ‘Anti Social Behaviour update’ by Inspector Mark Smith.
iv. Site on Elm Road North and its possible development into more flats raised by Ann Carter via e-mail. Maxine reported that no planning application has been submitted and it is not known what the proposed use will be, and has responded directly on this.
Minute Decision :
Resolved that Rob Beresford to report back on Merseyfest once further discussions with the other Merseyside Councils has taken place.
Minute 4 - Area co-ordinators report
Minute Text :
Cllr Doyle thanked Maxine for her detailed report and the work she had put into it. The report included:
- An update (page 33) on the former college site meeting which had taken place on 23rd June.
- An update on the Storeton Fields play area
- A report on the annual Older Persons Conference taking place on 13th October.
- Detailed reports from the Oxton Society and the Prenton Tenants and Residents Association.
Mr Neale asked for a comment (Page 28/29) on parking issues in Woodchurch Road and the recent headline article in the Wirral Globe suggesting that civil servants were going to charge for residents parking.
Cllr Bridson replied that at a recent meeting at the Town Hall, there had been discussions concerning the Residents Only parking scheme and the Tranmere Rovers scheme. She explained that the Tranmere Rovers scheme works very well and there was no intention to change that. She also explained that Cllr Doyle and herself had spoken at the meeting in support of the residents and that the majority of the public present appeared to have come from the Prenton area. She explained that the Wirral Globe report was very biased and a Liberal Democrat motion passed at that meeting called for monies raised from fines to fund a review of all the affected roads.
Cllr Holbrook said that he hoped that the resolution passed at that meeting would not be left in limbo and would be passed on to Cabinet for action as soon as possible.
Cllr Doyle said that along with most things to do with the Council, there were cost implications in implementing the resolution.
Minute Decision :
Resolved that Maxine be thanked for her report.
Minute 5 - Area Plans
Minute Text :
Maxine explained that one of the key tasks for the Area Forum is the development of a specific local area plan that reflected the needs and priorities of the Area Forum. The Area Plan Sub-Group has now been formed and consists of Cllr Frank Doyle, Alan Dollery, Patrick Toosey, Tony Garrett, Rob Beresford, Inspector Mark Smith, Richard Neale and Dr. Abhi Mantgani. The first meeting has been arranged for 17th November 2005. Maxine invited members of the Forum to become involved and to contact her if they wished to do so.
Minute Decision :
Resolved that any members wishing to join the Area Plan sub group contact Maxine on 0151 691 8266.
Minute 6 - Community initiatives fund
Minute Text :
Maxine reported that the Assessment Panel had met on Monday, 5th September to discuss the allocation of awards. For 2005/06 there is a budget of £12,882.66 in the Community Initiatives Fund, £3000 in the Community Safety Fund and £1500 in the Local Agenda 21 Fund. £7650.05 is still left in the Community Initiatives Fund, £550 in the Community Safety Fund, but all of the Local Agenda 21 Fund had been allocated.
A member of the public asked if new applications could be made and Maxine confirmed that they can, and it is anticipated that the next round of applications will be take place late November / early December. She also confirmed that the limit is normally £1000, but this figure can be exceeded if the Panel agree. Cllr Doyle explained that in the current round of applications, the Prenton Tenants and Residents Association had received a grant of £3500 towards four computers and two playstation consoles, etc.
Minute 7 - Primary Care Trust update
Minute Text :
Cllr Doyle reminded the Forum that it had been decided to move the Primary Care Trust update further up the Agenda and handed over to Margaret Davies from the Wirral NHS Trust and Dr Kidd from the Primary Care Trust, for an update on Access To Services.
Margaret gave an update on car parking at Arrowe Park and Clatterbridge Hospitals, with the latter now having nearly as many problems as Arrowe Park. They are:
- In the process of implementing the green transport plan at Arrowe Park, which will include encouraging alternative means of transport for staff and visitors.
- Having talks with local public transport companies with the aim of introducing more buses to Arrowe Park Hospital.
- Re-investing in the park and ride scheme to enable the present system to continue.
- Negotiating with Mersey Travel, with the aim of providing improved and cheaper bus services.
- Aiming for staff and visitors parking to be more conveniently located, together with disabled drivers. This will include aim to provide better access for disabled drivers, better security, clamping of inconsiderately parked cars, and promote car sharing amongst staff in order to reduce parking problems. The Patients Advisory Liaison Service are aware of these problems, especially regarding disabled patients.
- Ploughing the proposed charges into the park and ride scheme and increased security staff. It will be a pay-on-exit by a barrier system which is to commence in the near future.
- Displaying a free-phone taxi number at the front of the hospital.
Margaret invited comments from the floor and advised that members of the public could ring the freephone hotline or the PALS service.
Q. Mr Carl Reeley (member of the public) - expressed his disgust that staff on low wages should have to pay to park and also queried the park and ride scheme and questioned whether the car parking charges are just a way of obtaining revenue.
A. Margaret - domestic staff will not be paying the same rate as senior doctors and charges will depend on salary, with revenue being used to fund the park and ride scheme.
Q. Mr Garrett - asked about the proposed new bus services with Mersey Travel.
A. Margaret - it is hoped there will be more evening services and that the existing park and ride service will continue. A park and ride scheme from Tranmere Rovers F.C. is still under negotiation and the bus shelter is being extended.
A member of the public said they felt that the park and ride scheme is not advertised or publicised enough.
Cllr Holbrook commented that he hoped that other subsidised services would not be dropped in order to fund services to the hospital and wondered whether the PCT would be paying towards this.
Q. Alan Dollery - commented that the car parking situation is not getting any better and asked if there were any plans to change visiting hours?
A. Margaret - they have reduced visiting hours to afternoons and evenings, but it is mainly the nursing staff that has trouble parking.
Mr Morgan (member of the public) commented that he was involved with the original planning of the hospital site and anticipated problems then, and feels that the public are not listened to on this subject. Also the location of supermarkets and the local cemetery have escalated the problems.
Cllr Doyle drew this discussion to a close as the Oxton & Prenton Area Forum was not a decision making body and could only pass on the public’s concerns to the Hospital, which hopefully Margaret Davies would do.
Dr Katie Kidd from the PCT informed the Forum that there is going to be a reconfiguration of Primary Care Trusts over the Wirral, with the aim of trying to reduce the amount that is spent on management costs. It is proposed that the Birkenhead & Wirral PCT and the Bebington and West Wirral PCT will become one. This proposal has been put forward and discussions are taking place. The Department of Health is holding a national liaising exercise to see what people want from health and social care in the community and she had ten copies of the NHS consultation document if anyone wanted to take one, and copies are also available on-line.
There is also a new choose and book service for elective hospital treatment, e.g. surgical procedures, where a GP will provide information on different hospitals allowing people to choose where and when they will receive their treatment. There are plans to continue having the cataract surgery mobile unit at St. Catherine’s, and enabling patients to choose more convenient care. It is hoped that under the new arrangements, primary care services will be extended to near where people live. She invited questions from the floor but there were none.
Minute Decision :
Resolved that:
i. Margaret Davies and Dr Katy Kidd be thanked for their updates
ii. Margaret Davies be requested to pass on the public’s concerns to the Hospital
Minute 8 - Public question time
Minute Text :
Cllr Doyle suggested that questions related to law and order and police issues be taken under Item 10 on the Agenda, Anti-Social Behaviour Update, and asked if there were any other questions.
Q. Cllr Doyle raised a question on behalf of Mr J. Fryer concerning the Oxton Festival - Will the festival be repeated again in view of the complaints from local residents.
A. Cllr Doyle - it will, subject to getting approval, if someone applies to organise it.
Mr Fryer, who was present, replied that local residents objected to the level of noise and wanted assurance from the Council that it would not be taking place again.
Cllr Kelly confirmed that it was allowed to go ahead this year, as the organiser had redesigned his proposals to the satisfaction of enforcement officers. It was difficult to see on what legitimate grounds the Council had to refuse the application. The event only lasts for two days of the year on a green space open to everybody, which would make it difficult to prevent it taking place. There are similar community events held at public open spaces in Birkenhead Park and New Brighton (Wirral Show) and that such events should be supported.
Mr. Fryer replied that the level of noise was the main concern.
Mr Reeley, the organiser of this event, apologised to local residents for the noise but said that 10,000 people attended this non-profit making event. It only takes place on two days a year, and as it is a music event a certain level of noise is expected. It is held on a public space that is there to be used by the public, not just for dog-walkers. Mr Reeley said that he is planning to hold next year’s event in July, the week before the Wirral Show.
Cllr Doyle said this would have to be negotiated at a separate time. Inspector Mark Smith commented that health and safety objections were raised the previous year, e.g. sanitation. He confirmed that the Police would have no objections to the event if basic health and safety regulations were met.
Q. Mr Mark Breelley (member of the public) - also complained about the noise and asked what the proper procedure is to make a formal complaint.
A. Cllr Doyle - write to Carole Jackson, Tourism and Marketing, north Annexe, Brighton Street, Wallasey, Wirral CH44 8ED.
Q. Cllr Doyle raised a question on behalf of Mr Morgan - concerned that the Council continue to overspend and under-estimate costs, with particular reference to the work at Charing Cross and the Cheshire Lines building, and asked if it was still leased.
A. Cllr Kelly confirmed that it is on a 25-year lease, and that there are many other buildings that are leased. Cheshire Lines was leased because it could accommodate a call centre and this is the main way of providing contact with the public and is the cheapest option.
Mr Morgan had also questioned the cold temperature in the Floral Pavilion and Maxine agreed to take this up and report back to him. Gary Cummings, Streetscene Manager, said that the work at Charing Cross was not being undertaken by the Council but by United Utilities and is being completed as quickly as possible.
Q. Mr Reeley – Can anything be done to revoke the licence extension granted to the Shrewsbury Arms in Oxton? Patrick Toosey (Oxton Society) reported that he had attended the licensing meeting and they had been granted an extra hour on Fridays and Saturdays. There is a public meeting on 7th December at St. Saviour’s Church Hall and invited Mr Reeley and other interested parties to go to that meeting.
A. Rob Beresford - local authorities can only make decisions on the basis of evidence of problems, not what people think might happen. The licence can only be changed and/or reviewed on the basis of that evidence. Cllr Holbrook said that since the responsibility for licensing hours has been transferred to the Council, councillors have been disappointed that they have been given limited opportunities to get involved in the objection process. They have to get written permission from somebody who lives near the pub to speak on their behalf. The legislation appears to give the licensee the benefit of the doubt when setting up their own hours but they must be accountable. He is worried how evidence is going to be used when reviews are being held and evidence may have to be recorded.
Cllr Anderson thanked Patrick Toosey and Rob Beresford for their contributions. She has received many complaints over the years from residents near the Shrewsbury Arms and feels we need the opportunity of a review. She suggested people should make a note of times, dates, etc. as it is an ongoing problem with pubs near houses. She recommended that people keep a personal note of anything they are worried about and contact the Council with these.
A member of the public said that in his experience, the Police do not do anything about it. He put in a complaint in August but has only had one e-mail in reply.
Inspector Mark Smith said he would speak to him separately about evidence.
Mr Reeley asked what people can do about fighting, etc. outside the pub, and was advised to attend the meeting at St. Saviour’s on 7th December.
Inspector Smith emphasised that the presentation of evidence at that meeting is important.
Alan Dollery reported that he had attended an informative conference regarding a scheme in Liverpool where problems caused by late night drinking are reported to their own District Judge who will then monitor what is going on; he hoped this scheme could be extended in other areas.
Cllr Doyle raised the issue from Mr Lennon, received under correspondence, and asked what additional information was required from the Conservation Officer on this matter. Mr Lennon's basic concern is the likelihood of any decision by the Authority to conduct an investigation into an extension of the Oxton Conservation Area would be either influenced or dependant on the offer of a financial contribution by the Oxton Society towards the cost of such an investigation.
Cllr Doyle said his understanding of the reply that it wasn’t. Cllr Holbrook said that if a developer objected to the boundary, the Council would not allow financial aspects to come into consideration. Cllr Doyle said that Maxine would clarify the position with the Council Officer concerned and ensure Mr Lennon was given a clear reply.
Minute Decision :
Resolved that:
i. Maxine contact the Floral Pavilion and include the response in the next Area Co-ordinators report
ii. Maxine contact the Conservation Officer in response to Mr Lennon’s enquiry and request that he make contact with Mr Lennon directly
iii. Patrick Toosey report back on the meeting to be held on 7th December regarding The Shrewsbury Arms
Minute 9 - Borough Road site update
Minute Text :
This had been covered under the Area Co-ordinator’s report and it was decided not to have any further discussions on this matter.
Minute 10 - Anti Social Behaviour update
Minute Text :
Mr Dowling (member of the public) said he was not happy with the position regarding contacting the Police via their call centres during hours when many small Police stations are not manned. He gave details of an incident involving his property in which he had had great difficulty obtaining a Police response. He followed this up with a letter to the Senior Police Officer of Wirral, but had not as yet had an answer or a visit. When he had rung up, the incident could not be traced on the Police computer.
Inspector Smith said 999 calls are given priority and he accepted that it can be difficult to get in touch with the Police because of the volume of calls. In respect of the incident concerned, a log number should have been created from the moment the Police reported it and should have been recorded. Inspector Smith agreed to respond directly on this.
Mrs McCarthy brought up the issue of ongoing problems of allotment fires on the Mount Estate.
Inspector Smith said they would be trying to work with the problems. However, this area is covered by Ian Shaw and agreed to pass on his phone number so that she could speak to Ian direct.
Inspector Smith reported the major development of the Section 30 Dispersal Order, which is new legislation dealing with anti-social behaviour. This allows the Police to effectively break up groups of two or more people and will be effective in dealing with the groups of youths who congregate in The Arno.
Alan Dollery wondered why this had not been extended to the Prenton Dell area and Inspector Smith said he would be working with his colleague, Inspector Shaw, to ensure that these powers are enforced in his areas as well.
June Foster commented on her difficulties in contacting the Police and stated that she would have liked a representative from Upton Police Station to attend the Area Forum.
Maxine explained that the Police role is rotated between both Inspectors with them attending alternative meetings; Inspector Shaw will therefore be attending the next meeting.
A member of the public asked what was being done about the problem of motorbikes in The Arno.
Inspector Smith - there is new legislation which allows them to seize bikes like mopeds which are being driven irresponsibly.
Inspector Smith also reported on a dispersal order which will come into effect from 17th October and will cover Woodchurch Road, Storeton Road, Ingestre Road and Holmlands Way. Police will have the power to move on groups of two or more people, ban people from the area for up to 24 hours and take home under 16’s found after 9.00pm. This will be enforced until 3rd January 2006. It can be subject to refinement of a larger area if displacement is identified.
Minute Decision :
Resolved that:
i. Inspector Smith contact Mr Dowling regarding his enquiry
ii. Inspector Smith to give Mrs McCarthy contact details of Inspector Shaw
iii. Inspector Smith be thanked for his update
Minute 11 - Presentation: Working together for Wirral's Children & Young People
Minute Text :
Cllr Doyle invited David Griffith from Educational and Cultural Services to give the Forum a short presentation on the proposed changes in the way services for children will be organised in Wirral. The changes will enable the Council to comply with ‘Every Child Matters’ the new green paper set up following the death of Victoria Climbié, that forms part of the Children Act 2004. This instructs all services to work together to deliver the following five key outcomes for children in Wirral:
- Being Healthy
- Staying Safe
- Enjoy and Achieve
- Make a Positive Contribution
- Achieve Economic Wellbeing
A new green paper 'Youth Matters' picks up these issues for 14-19 year olds.
The services must integrate into one strategy. Now we have one single plan for children and young people, which all agencies will work to and work together on. It has been agreed that from April 2006 there will be one department – Children’s Services. The Cabinet member dealing with this area of work will be Councillor Phil Davies. There is also a Director Designate, Howard Cooper.
The Children and Young People’s Plan will be available by the end of this month. It will work in partnership with universal services, such as teachers and GP’s and targeted/specialised services such as Youth Offending workers, Paediatricians, etc.
Multidisciplinary Children’s Services Teams, of 11 areas and 4 districts in line with the area forums, are to be set up to add value to what we are doing and the delivery of our targeted and specialised services. The aim is to ensure that the specific needs of neighbourhoods are taken into consideration when supporting children, and we are seeking advice on who should be involved in these (it may be that representatives from the area forums will take part in these district management services).
Copies of a consultation paper were available at the meeting and we would welcome your comments on this and at the back of the consultation paper there is a form to fill in (it is also available online). It is important that people should be aware and provide feedback.
After the presentation he invited questions from the floor:
Cllr Kelly said that he hoped that the Police, who were an integral part of the new set-up, would be re-organised along the lines of the eleven Area Forums as opposed to the eight current Police areas.
Mr Griffiths said that he did not envisage that this would happen but there were already very good lines of communication with the Police.
Mike Walker said he had left a handout entitled Safer Wirral for the public to take with them as they left the meeting and the statistics in that pack suggest that Wirral is a safe place to live.
Minute Decision :
Resolved that David Griffith be thanked for his presentation.
Minute 12 - Dates of future meetings
Minute Text :
The date of the next meeting has been agreed as Wednesday, 15th February 2006 and will be held at Woodchurch Road Primary School at 7.00pm.
Minute 13 - Any other business
Minute Text :
Possible future presentations on offer to the Forum are the Development of a cycle network and Wirral Healthy Communities. Cllr Doyle reported to the meeting that Steve Maddox, Chief Executive intended coming to the next meeting. Cllr Doyle then thanked the audience for their attendance and looked forward to seeing them at the February meeting.
The meeting closed at 9.20pm.
(Minutes Published: 26 October 2005)