Agenda item

Update on Moreton Adult Centre

Minutes:

Cllr Blakeley then introduced Graham Hodkinson Director of DASS and Chris Beyga Head of Personal Support DASS who had been invited to the meeting to provide an update on Adult Day Centres.

 

Graham gave a brief overview of the current situation:

 

The Council needs to find savings of over 100M. Wirral is in the top 5% for its spending on the number of people with learning disabilities with a cost of £500 per head of population.

 

The Council’s total expenditure is six million with five being spent on in-house services and 1 million on transport costs. The challenge is to protect vulnerable groups of people however to balance public resources.

 

There is a proposal to close one Adult Day Centre and although he was aware the public would not agree with this proposal he explained there is spare capacity at all three centres, Eastham, Heswall and Moreton. The service can be run more efficiently by downsizing which would mean closing one centre to reflect levels of demand.

 

The key saving would come from reducing staff (a saving of 2M over three years) and transferring people to other centres.  He made reference to responses received from both consultations “What Really Matters” and “Transforming Day Services “ however a detailed 12-week consultation will be done if the proposals are agreed at full Council meeting on the 5th March.

 

A general discussion then followed with the following concerns and issues raised:

 

 

Q: Are you confident you will get your way with these proposals?

A: Graham Hodkinson: This proposal is subject to a final Council decision, I have no vote however there will be contingencies in place should the decision be made to close one centre.

 

Q: The figures show large centres more efficient than small centre, where is the rationale to close a day centre?

A: Graham Hodkinson: The cheapest model would be to operate one large day service.

 

Q: Pensby Wood has less spare capacity and won’t be able to take any dispersals

A: Graham Hodkinson: Consultation from 2012 highlighted people wanted smaller services so we are trying to balance legacy of larger centres with what people want.

 

Q: We contest the costs for Dale Farm, we can provide you with savings without closing the centre.

A: Graham Hodkinson; There is a three month window for consultation, we would be happy to respond to you directly.

 

Q: We have written to Chris Beyga and Graham Burgess however not to you so would like to meet with you.

A: Graham Hodkinson: I would be happy to meeting with you

 

Q We would ask you to treat people as human beings, the closure of Riverside where asbestos was found resulted in a building closing down and not being used. Also the current transport system makes no sense.

A: Graham Hodkinson: We must carry out individual needs assessments and will deal with people as people. I wasn’t here when Riverside closed so can’t make a comment on that. In relation to transport, agree it needs improvement and it appears to be no correlation between where service users live as to which day centre they use.

 

Q: This meeting is the most attended due to depth of feeling, there are some discrepancies with the figures in the report I have seen.

A: Christine Beyga: The figures were from a staff consultation and have been taken out of context from the report.

Graham Hodkinson: There is a more formal document which illustrates that each of the centres can offer additional sessions

 

Q: Can I see the informal information?

A: Graham Hodkinson: These figures have come from Day Centre Managers.

 

Q: Moreton has 133 service users who at any time can be out in the community so when an officer rings up to confirm numbers these are not included in those figures so there will be a discrepancy each time.

A: Christine Beyga: Those users out in the community are included in the figures.

 

Q: At the Council Meeting on 5th March which way will this forum’s councillors vote?

A: Cllr Blakeley: Cllr Steve Williams, Cllr Ian Lewis and I will be voting against the closures.

A: Cllr Leech: My group has not met to discuss the Cabinets proposals

Q: Cllr Blakeley: Do you agree with your Cabinets proposals.

A: Cllr Leech I can not answer until the Labour group has met to discuss them. I will be looking at all aspects before I make my decision

 

 

Q: My daughter travels to the centre in Moreton however if transport is cut back and she has to be taken to another centre her independence will be taken away as she will be unable to travel by public transport.

A: Graham Hodkinson: The question of transport needs to be addressed, as said before there is no correlation where people live to which centre they use.

Cllr Blakeley: If you close centres you remove choice

 

Q: If savings of 2 Million need to be made over 3 years, how is that possible as half of that will go in additional transport costs, consultation and employing trainers?

A: Graham Hodkinson: Training is essential and we are working with Merseytravel to fund travel training

 

Q: People are very upset and have been crying as many of the service users are unable to cope with change.

A: Graham Hodkinson: I have spent a lot of my career trying to make savings by closing buildings and services however have found new ways of working and people have loved it and loved change although I am aware people on the autistic spectrum do struggle with change.

 

Q; Where is the choice, my son is very upset and has gone to the same day centre for thirty-three years?

A: Graham Hodkinson: Subject to Council’s decision we will visit each centre in order to look at alternative ideas for delivery. Meetings will be arranged with carers within a week or two once the decision is made as to which day centre which will be closing.

 

Q: Where is your evidence that people with learning disabilities love change?

A: Graham Hodkinson:  I have corresponded with service users over the years, one lady in particular was now able to make choices around her shopping and wrote to thank me. This lady was supported by her carer to write the letter but it was her feelings.

 

Q: You are destroying people’s human rights, a friend’s family moved house to just half a mile away to their son’s day centre and he was distraught at this upheaval.

A: Graham Hodkinson: I did say some people with learning disabilities dislike change particularly on the autistic spectrum.

 

Q: We want change and improvements however we are against the way you are planning these changes and you need to assess the facts. We can give you proposals that save you money and still save the service.

A: Graham Hodkinson: We all want transformational change, downsizing is a logical way forward.

 

Q: Cllr Lewis: How long have you got to make a decision once Council has met as to which centre will close?

A: Graham Hodkinson; Within one to two weeks.

Q: Cllr Lewis:  Our suggestion would be to not close centres but to also look at preparing contingency plans.

 

Q: Cllr Williams: I have received letters from service users and 99% make reference to trauma around the potential closures

 

Cllr Blakeley then concluded the discussion by thanking the public for showing dignity in such difficult circumstances.